avet sx - Kayak Fishing Adventures on Big Water’s Edge

tymo · 12-12-2009, 12:30 PM

what # spectra for an avet sx plus a mono top shot i want to have a enough line not to get spooled this is my first avet and was just looking for some advice

Fiskadoro · 12-12-2009, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tymo

what # spectra for an avet sx plus a mono top shot i want to have a enough line not to get spooled this is my first avet and was just looking for some advice

I like forty pound power pro with a five foot topshot of 30 pound Seagar Fluro.

wade · 12-12-2009, 01:35 PM

dont mean to hijack u tymo from the avet, but..one sec please..

Whats the knot configuration you are using on the connections Jim?
-if u are using a uni2uni, how many turns on each? same #?

The reason I ask is because when I decided to "finally" make this switch, I recently hooked up on something Really big 2 times, and the 65# spectra seemed to blow out my 30# mono/flouro ..
Not being familiar with Spectra I instantly stripped it, but a buddy thinks it might have just been failure due to the powerful shark?..
I want to avoid this next round...I used to swear up & down i would be a mono guy forever but I know i will be pulled into the forest 1 day soon & be very thankful of braid..

Thanks

W

tymo · 12-12-2009, 01:38 PM

thanks for the advice and dont worry about thread jacking i actually had a similar question

EFISH · 12-12-2009, 01:52 PM

Wade try the Bob Sands knot. Much better hold when it comes to joining spectra to mono or floro
EFISH

Fiskadoro · 12-12-2009, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade

Whats the knot configuration you are using on the connections Jim?
W

I use a Tony Pena knot which casts beautifully through the guides:

You can read about how to do one here:
http://www.frenzytackle.com/tips/pena.htm

I've tried everything but have settled on that knot.

Great very easy to tie knot especially good for joining 30 to 50 pound mono to 40 to eighty pound spectra.

I like it cause I can tie it fast and get it to come out right every time. That said if you don't get the mono knot tight it can slip, but it's better then a albright or uni to uni in my opinion.

A trick I use is: after the knot is tied I just touch the mono knot end with super glue, and since I have started doing that I have never had it slip or fail in the field. I actually carry super glue in my gear just for topshots.

All that said: The Bob sands knot is the same not with a uni on the mono end instead of a overhand knot. It's supposedly stronger but it's harder for me to tie, and it does not cast as well as the Tony Pena knot.

Good luck, Jim

DESTROYER · 12-12-2009, 02:49 PM

Jim- I just learned how to tie that knot. Since the weather has been crap, I thoght to myself what was the weekest part of my game and it's knot tying. This is a great thread. Do you think the Tony Pena knot is better than the Albright? I just learned how to tie that one as well and it seems a lot cleaner than the TP knot.

What are your favorite Knots?

I use a Palomar knot just about for everything.

People say the a Dropper Loop is not good, but I landed YT up to 40# on it.

Let's hear it fellas!

Billy V · 12-12-2009, 03:08 PM

I use a 25 turn Albright for Mono to Spectra.
-Its a Squidco favorite and those guys tie a lot of top shot knots.

You could imagine the internet outcry if it was a bad connection, or that knot was failing.

Its easy to tie and see if the knot is dressed correctly, as the coils will line up cleanly next to another.
I have not had one fail.
------------------------------
I never use a Palomar Knot, unless I want the Hook to break off in the event I snag kelp. The same goes for the Dropper Loop knot. The D-Loop works good if you hook a BSB and want - a break-off, but you will leave him with a hook.
-It works for yellowtail, but I still don't like it.
I would rather use a double surgeon, or triple surgeon knot, or a 3 way swivel with SD jam knots at the connections.

I always use the San Diego Jam Knot for everything, including a straight Spectra connection.
15 turns on 65-80 straight spectra holds without slippage to a hook, or swivel.

On Mono I use a 5 turn on 30 or 40 lb test.

You can also use a double SD Jam Knot in Spectra for a larger knot, or large fish (bigger that our YT)

Fiskadoro · 12-12-2009, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MOYER THE FISH DESTROYER

What are your favorite Knots?

I use a Palomar knot just about for everything.

People say the a Dropper Loop is not good, but I landed YT up to 40# on it.

Mono to hook to 25 lbs Old style improved clinch knot.
Mono to hook 30lbs and up Palomar
Spectra to mono with mono up to 80lbs Tony Pena
Spectra to mono with mono over 80lbs Albright with doubled spectra... doubled with a bimini twist

Of those knots I am least happy with the Palomar, which needs to be retied often because it eventually always slips over time.I do not use a dropper loop as it breaks under it's line test, but instead I use the drop slide rig which is my own invention.

Reprinted...

Drop Slide Rig (JD Dropper)

I came up with this about a year ago for fishing macks and smelt up
north around Esco County and BKR. I call it the drop slide rig, my
buddy who's now using it as well calls it the JD dropper. We both have
had very good luck with it.

Here's the logic behind it. I like the dropper loop for fishing
macks because if you keep the line tight on the drop they can't twist
up the line and I like the fact it keeps them under control and off the
bottom when the rig is down. The drawbacks of a traditional dropper are
the poor knot strength, the fact that if the fish takes the bait he has
to take two lines in his mouth instead of one, and if you try to let
them run with the bait they end up feeling the weight if they run much
at all.

To get around all this I came up with this:

So here's the setup I take a small 1/4 inch long piece of clear
3/16 tubing and slide it on my mainline. I then tie the hook on with a
palomar knot. That's pretty much a 100% connection from the fish to the
reel when hooked up. I then tie 2 1/2 feet of ten pound test fluoro to
the center of the tube with a uni or improved clinch (my preference)

Here's the detail:

I then I tie the other end of the ten pound to my weight.

When hanging with the line tight it hangs and fishes just like a
dropper and the mack or bait can raise hell but he just can't tangle
it, but if you get a hit or a bump you can slack your line and let the
fish or bait run, because the line will slide right through the tube.

All and all the rig is not really any more visible the dropper loop, and it does everything it can do, but with some real advantages.

So that's the knots I use. Since I first posted about the drop slide on Bloody Decks I have gotten maybe two dozen e-mails from guys that are using it. Every one of them said it worked great for them. It's now my favorite way to fish bait.

Good luck, Jim

MarkT · 12-12-2009, 04:43 PM

I use 50# spectra (diameter of 12# mono) with 20# mono on top on my SX. I used a bob sands/tony pena knot to join then together. A uni/uni works fine too but the bs/tp is lower profile. I like an improved clinch to tie on the hook and a double surgeon or seaguar knot to tie on a fluoro leader. Pina Coladas and walks on the beach are nice too.

DESTROYER · 12-12-2009, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkT

Pina Coladas and walks on the beach are nice too.

I'm more of a shot of Tequila and Beer Chaser man myself. That made me laugh though

This is good stuff!

tattuna · 12-12-2009, 07:23 PM

I'm surprised to hear you guys don't like the palomar. It's about the only knot I use. I landed a 35 lb yt in the Sea of Cortez this summer on a locked drag that worked me like no other fish ever has and the knot held up fine even though it pulled so hard it bent my Megabait!

I've always used a bimini to albright, but it's a lot of tying. Recently switched over to the Alberto knot (modified albright?), and it's a lot easier to tie and supposed to be stronger. http://www.stripersonline.com/Pages/...tos_knot.shtml Only thing I've pulled on it with so far is a rock

but the connection held and it snapped on the mono.

Pescavore1 · 12-12-2009, 11:16 PM

I've been using the World's Fair Knot exclusively for about 7 years. It's easy as the Palomar knot but I believe it is much stronger. One thing I don't like about the Palomar knot is that the lines sometimes cross and cut into itself, whereas the WF Knot does not. I've caught up to 50# albie and WSB with it.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/917445...ot_how_to_tie/

Gino · 12-12-2009, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Day

I use a Tony Pena knot which casts beautifully through the guides:

You can read about how to do one here:
http://www.frenzytackle.com/tips/pena.htm

I've tried everything but have settled on that knot.

Great very easy to tie knot especially good for joining 30 to 50 pound mono to 40 to eighty pound spectra.

I like it cause I can tie it fast and get it to come out right every time. That said if you don't get the mono knot tight it can slip, but it's better then a albright or uni to uni in my opinion.

A trick I use is: after the knot is tied I just touch the mono knot end with super glue, and since I have started doing that I have never had it slip or fail in the field. I actually carry super glue in my gear just for topshots.

All that said: The Bob sands knot is the same not with a uni on the mono end instead of a overhand knot. It's supposedly stronger but it's harder for me to tie, and it does not cast as well as the Tony Pena knot.

Good luck, Jim

Tony Pena cant be beat

Fiskadoro · 12-13-2009, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MOYER THE FISH DESTROYER

I'm more of a shot of Tequila and Beer Chaser man myself.

Ahhhhh that's the ticket

Billy V · 12-13-2009, 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pescavore1

I've been using the World's Fair Knot exclusively for about 7 years. It's easy as the Palomar knot but I believe it is much stronger. One thing I don't like about the Palomar knot is that the lines sometimes cross and cut into itself, whereas the WF Knot does not. I've caught up to 50# albie and WSB with it.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/917445...ot_how_to_tie/

That has been my experience with the Palomar knot. Even if you are careful when tying it, sometimes it happens.

lamb · 12-13-2009, 08:42 AM

I think sometimes chit happens just because it's meant to be... regardless of your knot.

Good stuff. All of these knots are good, some people seem to prefer one over the others.

Since I'm lefty, I've mostly been winding Avets. I got 4-5 SXes. I put 250 to 300 yards of 40# spectra, (lately 50#, mostly because at Squidco never seem to have 40#

). Since that won't fill up your spool, you need to put some mono backing - the same or heavier line than your spectra strength. Squidco guys do it for me, ditto on them using Albright. That will give you plenty of line, especially for the kayak, as the "tow me around please" button is always in auto mode. You will not have to worry about being spooled.

I'm a knot retard, and I was never comfortable in my skills when it comes to tieing mono and spectra together for the few feet of floro top shot. I just use a 2 way swivel. I've never regretted it. Do not spare a few $$ on quality floro for the top shot. Some days it won't matter, floro or not. They ARE days when it definitely matters.

For the hook or a jig, I use San Diego knot. You do need to have something to jam your hook against when tightening it - plenty of eyelets on a kayak for that

dmrides · 12-14-2009, 01:47 PM

This has been really helpful thread.

I was curious about using the JD Dropper and wanted to give it a try. Does anyone know where I could find clear plastic tubing with that small of a diameter?

Thanks.

Fiskadoro · 12-14-2009, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmrides

This has been really helpful thread.

I was curious about using the JD Dropper and wanted to give it a try. Does anyone know where I could find clear plastic tubing with that small of a diameter?

Thanks.

It's 1/8 Pneumatic tubing. I get mine a Graingers supply local in LA. I know there's one not too far from La Jolla but I can't remember exactly where it is.

Jim

PescadorPete · 12-14-2009, 03:23 PM

I use the Sinker Slides for this rig. Its popular on the East Coast for flounder and fluke fishing.

12-12-2009, 12:30 PM	#1
tymo Junior Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 21	avet sx what # spectra for an avet sx plus a mono top shot i want to have a enough line not to get spooled this is my first avet and was just looking for some advice

12-12-2009, 03:08 PM	#8
Billy V Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bay Ho Posts: 1,382	I use a 25 turn Albright for Mono to Spectra. -Its a Squidco favorite and those guys tie a lot of top shot knots. You could imagine the internet outcry if it was a bad connection, or that knot was failing. Its easy to tie and see if the knot is dressed correctly, as the coils will line up cleanly next to another. I have not had one fail. ------------------------------ I never use a Palomar Knot, unless I want the Hook to break off in the event I snag kelp. The same goes for the Dropper Loop knot. The D-Loop works good if you hook a BSB and want - a break-off, but you will leave him with a hook. -It works for yellowtail, but I still don't like it. I would rather use a double surgeon, or triple surgeon knot, or a 3 way swivel with SD jam knots at the connections. I always use the San Diego Jam Knot for everything, including a straight Spectra connection. 15 turns on 65-80 straight spectra holds without slippage to a hook, or swivel. On Mono I use a 5 turn on 30 or 40 lb test. You can also use a double SD Jam Knot in Spectra for a larger knot, or large fish (bigger that our YT) Last edited by Billy V; 12-12-2009 at 03:19 PM.

12-12-2009, 07:23 PM	#12
tattuna Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Pasadena Posts: 329	I'm surprised to hear you guys don't like the palomar. It's about the only knot I use. I landed a 35 lb yt in the Sea of Cortez this summer on a locked drag that worked me like no other fish ever has and the knot held up fine even though it pulled so hard it bent my Megabait! I've always used a bimini to albright, but it's a lot of tying. Recently switched over to the Alberto knot (modified albright?), and it's a lot easier to tie and supposed to be stronger. http://www.stripersonline.com/Pages/...tos_knot.shtml Only thing I've pulled on it with so far is a rock but the connection held and it snapped on the mono. __________________ IG @tattuna

12-12-2009, 11:16 PM	#13
Pescavore1 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Scripps Ranch Posts: 82	World's Fair Knot I've been using the World's Fair Knot exclusively for about 7 years. It's easy as the Palomar knot but I believe it is much stronger. One thing I don't like about the Palomar knot is that the lines sometimes cross and cut into itself, whereas the WF Knot does not. I've caught up to 50# albie and WSB with it. http://www.metacafe.com/watch/917445...ot_how_to_tie/

12-13-2009, 08:42 AM	#17
lamb Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,568	I think sometimes chit happens just because it's meant to be... regardless of your knot. Good stuff. All of these knots are good, some people seem to prefer one over the others. Since I'm lefty, I've mostly been winding Avets. I got 4-5 SXes. I put 250 to 300 yards of 40# spectra, (lately 50#, mostly because at Squidco never seem to have 40# ). Since that won't fill up your spool, you need to put some mono backing - the same or heavier line than your spectra strength. Squidco guys do it for me, ditto on them using Albright. That will give you plenty of line, especially for the kayak, as the "tow me around please" button is always in auto mode. You will not have to worry about being spooled. I'm a knot retard, and I was never comfortable in my skills when it comes to tieing mono and spectra together for the few feet of floro top shot. I just use a 2 way swivel. I've never regretted it. Do not spare a few $$ on quality floro for the top shot. Some days it won't matter, floro or not. They ARE days when it definitely matters. For the hook or a jig, I use San Diego knot. You do need to have something to jam your hook against when tightening it - plenty of eyelets on a kayak for that __________________ [------------------------ <)))< ....b-a-a-a-a

12-12-2009, 01:35 PM	#3
wade Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Oceanside Posts: 1,214	dont mean to hijack u tymo from the avet, but..one sec please.. Whats the knot configuration you are using on the connections Jim? -if u are using a uni2uni, how many turns on each? same #? The reason I ask is because when I decided to "finally" make this switch, I recently hooked up on something Really big 2 times, and the 65# spectra seemed to blow out my 30# mono/flouro .. Not being familiar with Spectra I instantly stripped it, but a buddy thinks it might have just been failure due to the powerful shark?.. I want to avoid this next round...I used to swear up & down i would be a mono guy forever but I know i will be pulled into the forest 1 day soon & be very thankful of braid.. Thanks W

12-12-2009, 01:38 PM	#4
tymo Junior Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 21	thanks for the advice and dont worry about thread jacking i actually had a similar question

12-12-2009, 01:52 PM	#5
EFISH Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: in my head Posts: 31	Wade try the Bob Sands knot. Much better hold when it comes to joining spectra to mono or floro EFISH

12-12-2009, 02:49 PM	#7
DESTROYER Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: "The Table" Posts: 976	Jim- I just learned how to tie that knot. Since the weather has been crap, I thoght to myself what was the weekest part of my game and it's knot tying. This is a great thread. Do you think the Tony Pena knot is better than the Albright? I just learned how to tie that one as well and it seems a lot cleaner than the TP knot. What are your favorite Knots? I use a Palomar knot just about for everything. People say the a Dropper Loop is not good, but I landed YT up to 40# on it. Let's hear it fellas!

12-12-2009, 04:43 PM	#10
MarkT Deep Release Specialist Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Mission Viejo Posts: 94	I use 50# spectra (diameter of 12# mono) with 20# mono on top on my SX. I used a bob sands/tony pena knot to join then together. A uni/uni works fine too but the bs/tp is lower profile. I like an improved clinch to tie on the hook and a double surgeon or seaguar knot to tie on a fluoro leader. Pina Coladas and walks on the beach are nice too.

12-14-2009, 01:47 PM	#18
dmrides Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Point Loma Posts: 584	JD Dropper This has been really helpful thread. I was curious about using the JD Dropper and wanted to give it a try. Does anyone know where I could find clear plastic tubing with that small of a diameter? Thanks.