Lever drag vs Star Drag - Kayak Fishing Adventures on Big Water’s Edge

Gunner58 · 07-12-2015, 09:11 AM

Ok gents I came to the harsh realization yesterday as I lost 3 fish that I need to beef up my gear. I am looking at a few reels some are star drag and some are lever drags. What are the pros and cons of each. I have always used star drags for inshore. Any advice is appreciated

FISH11 · 07-12-2015, 10:01 AM

I have both but prefer my lever drag reels. Much easier to control the amount of drag. One thing that can't be matched is when fly lining a large (jumbo) mac that can over power the clicker, even with the line wrapped around the reel frame. You can just have the lever a little out of full free spool and apply enough drag to keep the line from constantly reel out. It allows you to apply enough resistance while still having the ability for the line to play out when a strike happens.

Gunner58 · 07-12-2015, 10:11 AM

Ya I would agree with that even though I have not used one. I am looking at the avets, penn and the diawa. I am looking for a good all around reel that won't break the bank

FISH11 · 07-12-2015, 10:15 AM

I just got a Daiwa Saltist LD40 2spd. I got it from Sports Chalet's web site. Got an e-mail from them that on the 4th they had a sale were if you signed up for Visa quick pay they gave you 25% off. Went right to the site I got the reel I had been shopping for and another rod. Super cool discount on the order and any problems Sports Chalet is close by.

FARRIER · 07-12-2015, 10:22 AM

How did you lose those 3 fish? Before you start blaming your gear I would test your terminal connections. That being said what did you lose them on. I had some good lessons from a friend who made me test my knots with actual weight. He filled a bucket with 25 pounds of weights and had me tie knots to a collection ring. I learned the problem was not my gear. Did you have clean breaks of your line or curly ques at the end or did they just come unbuttoned? You may need to beef up your knot arsenal before you start dropping coin.

Gunner58 · 07-12-2015, 10:35 AM

One just pulled the hook, one broke clean just above the hook (possible toothy critter) and one line broke by my uni to uni knot. I was using 30lb floro attached to 50lb braid. But that is a great idea with testing knots. I will start doing that

Mahigeer · 07-12-2015, 11:50 AM

Looks like your problem is more with the rig than the reel.

Some reels, like Avet, do not allow for you to readjust your drag, unless it is in free spool.

In another word, the range of the level drag setting cannot be done without going to free spool.

If your level is in maximum drag setting and fish still is taking line and you need to increase the drag. You must first go to free spool and adjust drag with a small knob. Then your level will have different drag setting.

Kind of hard to explain on line.

FlyFishinYakr · 07-12-2015, 12:13 PM

Rather than assuming you need to upgrade your gear, here's something anglers sometimes forget.
How old is your gear, when was the last time the drag washers were serviced? Is your drag smooth or jerky?
How old is your line (if using mono), or top-shot? What kind of knots are you using (if you're consistently breaking off at the connections)? Do you check your line/top-shot after catching/hooking a fish (did it take you into the kelp)? If there's one thing I learned from my time at a tackle shop (Art's Tackle in Gardena) or on the boats was to check or change my line often (and buy bulk spools). At least every 5-6 trips or once a month I would change my line (mono).
Lastly (and this is just my opinion) maybe you should upsize your gear a little? I generally fish 40# for

over 15-20# and when fishing around pesky dogs, kelp, pinnacles and if I'm fishing for food. I will fish 25-30# if the avg.

are under 15# and if for sport.
Something to contemplate before you start shelling out some coin to upgrade [unless you need an excuse to tell "the significant other" why you have to buy some new gear, in which case newer gear has better tech!

].
FFY

Gunner58 · 07-12-2015, 12:26 PM

Well to be honest it's a little of both. Reels are old so that could be part of the problem. I have two Abu 5500 that have been serviced not to long ago. I love those but prob not enough umph to handle those yellows. And I really do need to change out the line. It's about 1 year old so there are some other factors. But most of my bigger gear is about 10 or so years old so I think it's time to upgrade

parkermann · 07-12-2015, 01:03 PM

Check out some okuma reels. They now make some top of the line stuff. And they have a good amount a reels that are decently priced. The okuma Cedros and Cortez are great star drag reels and metaloid and andros are great lever drag.

And if you or someone you know is a first responder(cop, fireman, military, emt, ect) the okuma warehouse in Ontario gives you a 40% discount. My brother is a cop so he has been getting okuma gear at great prices

Gunner58 · 07-12-2015, 01:19 PM

Ya I am military so that would be great. Do you just call them direct?

HobieScot · 07-12-2015, 03:07 PM

It does sound like you may be experiencing multiple problems as mentioned above. I would check your connections first then your drag second. Make sure the connections are not failing and that your drag is smooth and not grabbing as it lets line is out. Easy to tell as it will be jerky when a fish pulls line.

If you check both and determine you need to upgrade your gear I have nothing but great things to say about the gear I have been using.

I have been fishing strictly Diawa for inshore and Avet for offshore for years. I swear by my Avets. I have not had one let me down or not be able to stop a fish yet.

With that being said on my last trip to Mexico I had a chance to try out a small Okuma lever drag (wish I knew which model it was) and I must say I was extremely impressed. The next time I want a new set up I will be looking into the Okumas.

parkermann · 07-12-2015, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gunner58

Ya I am military so that would be great. Do you just call them direct?

Call them to confirm the days but I think it's every Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday from 1-4.

taggermike · 07-12-2015, 03:36 PM

I started using a lever drag a few years ago. I went to a lever to control big macks on the slow troll. Like Fish11 said. I got tired of hearing the clicker all the time. Lever drags tend to be smoother and stronger. I've never used an Avet but my old Shimano TLD 15 works great. I'll second what others said about line and connections. Pulling hooks happens some times. Using the biggest hook that suits the bait can help. Breaking line or connections can come from sticky drags bit usually from old line or poor knots. Maybe practice your knots. Or try different knots to see how they work for you. YouTube is full of good tutorials for every knot. Mike

Nic D · 07-12-2015, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gunner58

I am looking at a few reels some are star drag and some are lever drags. What are the pros and cons of each.

In my humble opinion they serve different purposes. I will try and keep my answer brief.

Star Drag - good for live bait fishing and throwing jigs, iron etc.

Lever Drag - good for live bait fishing and trolling lures or live bait.

If the main use of your gear is to drag live macs around then a lever drag is what you want. It's much easier to control the drag settings with a lever drag.

Raskal311 · 07-12-2015, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nic D

In my humble opinion they serve different purposes. I will try and keep my answer brief.

Star Drag - good for live bait fishing and throwing jigs, iron etc.

Lever Drag - good for live bait fishing and trolling lures or live bait.

If the main use of your gear is to drag live macs around then a lever drag is what you want. It's much easier to control the drag settings with a lever drag.

100% agree... my $200 torium cast better then my $500 talica.

Silbaugh4liberty · 07-12-2015, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parkermann

Check out some okuma reels. They now make some top of the line stuff. And they have a good amount a reels that are decently priced. The okuma Cedros and Cortez are great star drag reels and metaloid and andros are great lever drag.

And if you or someone you know is a first responder(cop, fireman, military, emt, ect) the okuma warehouse in Ontario gives you a 40% discount. My brother is a cop so he has been getting okuma gear at great prices

Just got my cedros for father's day, I think Charkbait still has them for $80 off retail. I want the same size Cortez for surface iron since it has cast control, but I'm gonna wait for the 2016 version to come out (grey and black rather than hey and red).

I don't have any lever drags yet, but my first one will either be an okuma Metalloid or a Release SG (soon to be named Truth Reels). The Metalloid is basically in the Avet Raptor class at half the price. And the Release SG, is a single speed lever drag, 30lbs of drag, all machine aluminium, holds like 500 yards of 50lb braid. About $250 for those and Jim Sammons swears by them.

Gunner58 · 07-12-2015, 04:38 PM

Thanks for all the info guys. If the okuma wear house is still doing that I just may have to replace more than one reel and rod.

HobieScot · 07-12-2015, 05:33 PM

If you pick up the Okumas let us know what you think of them after a couple of fish. I'd love to hear your review

ful-rac · 07-12-2015, 05:43 PM

I definitely reccomend the avet MXJ, sweet reel perfect size, plenty of power and Made in the USA.

Also pretty easy to maintain and service.

07-12-2015, 09:11 AM	#1
Gunner58 Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 81	Lever drag vs Star Drag Ok gents I came to the harsh realization yesterday as I lost 3 fish that I need to beef up my gear. I am looking at a few reels some are star drag and some are lever drags. What are the pros and cons of each. I have always used star drags for inshore. Any advice is appreciated

07-12-2015, 10:01 AM	#2
FISH11 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Pine Valley when not fishing La Jolla Posts: 2,643	I have both but prefer my lever drag reels. Much easier to control the amount of drag. One thing that can't be matched is when fly lining a large (jumbo) mac that can over power the clicker, even with the line wrapped around the reel frame. You can just have the lever a little out of full free spool and apply enough drag to keep the line from constantly reel out. It allows you to apply enough resistance while still having the ability for the line to play out when a strike happens. __________________ MARK ......... 2016 MALIBU X FACTOR, 2020 SOLO SKIFF (Fishing Kayak on Steroids )

07-12-2015, 10:15 AM	#4
FISH11 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Pine Valley when not fishing La Jolla Posts: 2,643	I just got a Daiwa Saltist LD40 2spd. I got it from Sports Chalet's web site. Got an e-mail from them that on the 4th they had a sale were if you signed up for Visa quick pay they gave you 25% off. Went right to the site I got the reel I had been shopping for and another rod. Super cool discount on the order and any problems Sports Chalet is close by. __________________ MARK ......... 2016 MALIBU X FACTOR, 2020 SOLO SKIFF (Fishing Kayak on Steroids )

07-12-2015, 10:22 AM	#5
FARRIER Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Cmont [] Posts: 314	How did you lose those 3 fish? Before you start blaming your gear I would test your terminal connections. That being said what did you lose them on. I had some good lessons from a friend who made me test my knots with actual weight. He filled a bucket with 25 pounds of weights and had me tie knots to a collection ring. I learned the problem was not my gear. Did you have clean breaks of your line or curly ques at the end or did they just come unbuttoned? You may need to beef up your knot arsenal before you start dropping coin. __________________ "It depends on what the meaning of the words 'is' is." –Bill Clinton

07-12-2015, 12:13 PM	#8
FlyFishinYakr Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Nor Cal...30 min from Bodega/Tomales Bay, 1hr from Clear Lake, 2+ hr to Berryessa & the Delta Posts: 729	Check your drag washers lately? Rather than assuming you need to upgrade your gear, here's something anglers sometimes forget. How old is your gear, when was the last time the drag washers were serviced? Is your drag smooth or jerky? How old is your line (if using mono), or top-shot? What kind of knots are you using (if you're consistently breaking off at the connections)? Do you check your line/top-shot after catching/hooking a fish (did it take you into the kelp)? If there's one thing I learned from my time at a tackle shop (Art's Tackle in Gardena) or on the boats was to check or change my line often (and buy bulk spools). At least every 5-6 trips or once a month I would change my line (mono). Lastly (and this is just my opinion) maybe you should upsize your gear a little? I generally fish 40# for over 15-20# and when fishing around pesky dogs, kelp, pinnacles and if I'm fishing for food. I will fish 25-30# if the avg. are under 15# and if for sport. Something to contemplate before you start shelling out some coin to upgrade [unless you need an excuse to tell "the significant other" why you have to buy some new gear, in which case newer gear has better tech! ]. FFY

07-12-2015, 10:11 AM	#3
Gunner58 Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 81	Ya I would agree with that even though I have not used one. I am looking at the avets, penn and the diawa. I am looking for a good all around reel that won't break the bank

07-12-2015, 10:35 AM	#6
Gunner58 Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 81	One just pulled the hook, one broke clean just above the hook (possible toothy critter) and one line broke by my uni to uni knot. I was using 30lb floro attached to 50lb braid. But that is a great idea with testing knots. I will start doing that

07-12-2015, 11:50 AM	#7
Mahigeer Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,897	Looks like your problem is more with the rig than the reel. Some reels, like Avet, do not allow for you to readjust your drag, unless it is in free spool. In another word, the range of the level drag setting cannot be done without going to free spool. If your level is in maximum drag setting and fish still is taking line and you need to increase the drag. You must first go to free spool and adjust drag with a small knob. Then your level will have different drag setting. Kind of hard to explain on line.

07-12-2015, 12:26 PM	#9
Gunner58 Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 81	Well to be honest it's a little of both. Reels are old so that could be part of the problem. I have two Abu 5500 that have been serviced not to long ago. I love those but prob not enough umph to handle those yellows. And I really do need to change out the line. It's about 1 year old so there are some other factors. But most of my bigger gear is about 10 or so years old so I think it's time to upgrade

07-12-2015, 01:03 PM	#10
parkermann Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 63	Check out some okuma reels. They now make some top of the line stuff. And they have a good amount a reels that are decently priced. The okuma Cedros and Cortez are great star drag reels and metaloid and andros are great lever drag. And if you or someone you know is a first responder(cop, fireman, military, emt, ect) the okuma warehouse in Ontario gives you a 40% discount. My brother is a cop so he has been getting okuma gear at great prices

07-12-2015, 01:19 PM	#11
Gunner58 Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 81	Ya I am military so that would be great. Do you just call them direct?

07-12-2015, 03:07 PM	#12
HobieScot Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Posts: 370	It does sound like you may be experiencing multiple problems as mentioned above. I would check your connections first then your drag second. Make sure the connections are not failing and that your drag is smooth and not grabbing as it lets line is out. Easy to tell as it will be jerky when a fish pulls line. If you check both and determine you need to upgrade your gear I have nothing but great things to say about the gear I have been using. I have been fishing strictly Diawa for inshore and Avet for offshore for years. I swear by my Avets. I have not had one let me down or not be able to stop a fish yet. With that being said on my last trip to Mexico I had a chance to try out a small Okuma lever drag (wish I knew which model it was) and I must say I was extremely impressed. The next time I want a new set up I will be looking into the Okumas.

07-12-2015, 03:36 PM	#14
taggermike Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Chula Vista Posts: 1,589	I started using a lever drag a few years ago. I went to a lever to control big macks on the slow troll. Like Fish11 said. I got tired of hearing the clicker all the time. Lever drags tend to be smoother and stronger. I've never used an Avet but my old Shimano TLD 15 works great. I'll second what others said about line and connections. Pulling hooks happens some times. Using the biggest hook that suits the bait can help. Breaking line or connections can come from sticky drags bit usually from old line or poor knots. Maybe practice your knots. Or try different knots to see how they work for you. YouTube is full of good tutorials for every knot. Mike

07-12-2015, 04:38 PM	#18
Gunner58 Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 81	Thanks for all the info guys. If the okuma wear house is still doing that I just may have to replace more than one reel and rod.

07-12-2015, 05:33 PM	#19
HobieScot Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Posts: 370	If you pick up the Okumas let us know what you think of them after a couple of fish. I'd love to hear your review

07-12-2015, 05:43 PM	#20
ful-rac Emperor Join Date: May 2009 Location: Buena Park Posts: 3,649	I definitely reccomend the avet MXJ, sweet reel perfect size, plenty of power and Made in the USA. Also pretty easy to maintain and service. __________________ There's nothing colder than yesterday's hotdog.