DFG Meeting - A Newbie's Observations

[Tman]

Nice write up, you were definitely paying attention...

I'd like to add, when the woman that was in charge of Parks and Rec spoke, I liked how she brought up the possible tourist revenue to be lost by the closures and how some of them fell on their land (San Elijo, DP), and when asked by the commission if they were equipped to enforce, her response of having over 800 personnel.

It was quite obvious at this meeting who wanted to force closures down our throats. Bespectacled guy (forgot his name, far right side, patronizing idiot) seemed to be combative to every point of lost revenue, unfair process, and reactions to possible closures.

Even when Mr. Richards brought up the point of the closures seriously targeting areas where we fish the most, his comment...

"I knew this was going to be brought up so I prepared this chart."

What a crock of shit.

Where are your facts to back this up, under law, you must disclose them.
You are on the commission, this is supposed to be a fair and open process, just as in court proceedings, you are required to inform all parties involved beforehand. Where is your data to back up your claim?

Tell you what...I will make up my own chart showing you where I have caught the most fish, present it to you, for you to include in areas that are heavily overfished and should be protected.

I have caught no fish in all of LJ, Laguna, DP, and Malibu.

What I will do though is show you a chart of the coastline where I caught these fish and you will see that none of them were caught anywhere near LJ, Laguna, DP, or Malibu.

Let me know when you want to see my chart and we will compare it with your chart.

[GregAndrew]

Yep, according to our 8 year old SAT expert, 50% of the fish we eat comes from those endangered coral reefs. Good summary Bob. I think you may have given 3 of the commissioners way too much benefit of the DOUBT though. Their rubber stamps were already fashioned long ago, and they are going to let the appeals process deal with the mess that they make.

[dsafety]

I forgot to mention one other significant observation. If anyone is hoping to save any part of Laguna Beach from MLPA closures, your only hope is for this thing to get tossed. I may not agree with the point of view of the good citizens of Laguna Beach who showed up at this meeting, but I have to admire their organization.

This Laguna Beach contingent was supremely well organized. They were well spoken and all expressed their absolute support for closing all consumptive ocean access to the territorial waters of this city. If anyone in the crowd had a differing opinion, I did not hear it. Sure, it stunk of elitism, but the united message coupled with the lack of any argument from the opposition left a lasting impression on me.

We could probably learn something from the approach that this group has taken to get their point across.

Bob

[Iceman]

The thing that pissed me off the most was actually all the Laguna Beach people clamoring to keep all those stinky fishermen off "their" beaches. I will never spend a single dime in that city for the rest of my life.

This crowd of snooty @%^% always manage to get my blood boiling. They should have been reminded that they all had the same thing to say. There motives were very transparent to all.

[Holy Mackerel]

Thanks for attending yesterday! Good seeing familiar, and new faces, we had more people even with their bussed in kids.

Next up Santa Barbara ~December 15 or 16th, I believe that will be D-Day! (Decision day)

Get your carpool ready, I think my supercrew will be filled... Will post a thread closer to the date with specifics, and carpool lists.

[FISHIONADO]

Bob, thanks for attending and sharing your comments, wish I could have stayed until the end. It was a very busy day at work for me so I was on the phone or computer most of the time, but glad I could be there to represent. See you all in Santa Barbara!

[jbm]

Originally Posted by Holy Mackerel

Thanks for attending yesterday! Good seeing familiar, and new faces, we had more people even with their bussed in kids.

Next up Santa Barbara ~December 15 or 16th, I believe that will be D-Day! (Decision day)

Get your carpool ready, I think my supercrew will be filled... Will post a thread closer to the date with specifics, and carpool lists.

I may take the train if the schedule works out. Then I can gaze upon all the soon to be off-limits fishing areas on the way up.

[Holy Mackerel]

Originally Posted by jbm

I may take the train if the schedule works out. Then I can gaze upon all the soon to be off-limits fishing areas on the way up.

Interesting, more details, never done so... Cost? where does it leave from, because I am not looking forward to that drive!

[maui jim]

Originally Posted by Iceman

This crowd of snooty @%^% always manage to get my blood boiling. They should have been reminded that they all had the same thing to say. There motives were very transparent to all.

Oh the "Lagunites"......... that area in south OC are surely of group to them selves, I work in that area often, and it's the culture of the free spirted artists, to make everyday their day and save us from ourselves... They will do what's best for their bubble world...

Very Liberal town and thinking...................full of NIMBY's

[JoeBeck]

Bob,

Good write up and accurate. I think we were well represented by kayak and boat fishermen and I was happy to cede my time to clay.

Hunters Pa. It sounded like to me that they were trying to get the MPA reworded in the beginning of the meeting to allow sand replenishment. I actually had a good conversation about this with a lady representing Heel the Bay. She seemed opened to my thoughts because I told her this whole process angers me because they are targeting Recreational fishemen who have a small impact on the ocean environment and are people who care for it. That they are not targeting urban runoff, the damages of ocean front development that have created the need to replenish sand, dumping waist into our seas including cruise boats and poorly maintained city sewage lines..... on and on I went about other factors that effect the ocean and the fishing. I also let her know that this process has had a negative effect because it is dividing stewards of the environment into two groups having the fishermen dropping support for their organizations.

[Hunters Pa]

Originally Posted by JoeBeck

Bob,

Good write up and accurate. I think we were well represented by kayak and boat fishermen and I was happy to cede my time to clay.

Hunters Pa. It sounded like to me that they were trying to get the MPA reworded in the beginning of the meeting to allow sand replenishment. I actually had a good conversation about this with a lady representing Heel the Bay. She seemed opened to my thoughts because I told her this whole process angers me because they are targeting Recreational fishemen who have a small impact on the ocean environment and are people who care for it. That they are not targeting urban runoff, the damages of ocean front development that have created the need to replenish sand, dumping waist into our seas including cruise boats and poorly maintained city sewage lines..... on and on I went about other factors that effect the ocean and the fishing. I also let her know that this process has had a negative effect because it is dividing stewards of the environment into two groups having the fishermen dropping support for their organizations.

Yeah, Joe, they want to keep certain man-made impacts that alter the environment and ban others. All that sand was not there until development in the early part of the 20th century. The beaches were narrow & rocky - down past the surfline too. That rocky bottom provides better anchoring for kelp which would be better habitat for marine life. BUT Laguna wants their nice wide sandy beaches, so they approve of periodically trucking in more sand to replace what the ocean takes away. They call it "nourishment". I call it destruction of the natural environment.

Oh, and I am willing to bet that a lot of those Laguna closure activists have those houses with leaky septic systems that are directly polluting the water

[Hunters Pa]

Originally Posted by dsafety

I forgot to mention one other significant observation. If anyone is hoping to save any part of Laguna Beach from MLPA closures, your only hope is for this thing to get tossed. I may not agree with the point of view of the good citizens of Laguna Beach who showed up at this meeting, but I have to admire their organization.

This Laguna Beach contingent was supremely well organized. They were well spoken and all expressed their absolute support for closing all consumptive ocean access to the territorial waters of this city. If anyone in the crowd had a differing opinion, I did not hear it. Sure, it stunk of elitism, but the united message coupled with the lack of any argument from the opposition left a lasting impression on me.

We could probably learn something from the approach that this group has taken to get their point across.

Bob

Yep, when they get the reserve passed for Laguna I will be ready and waiting when they do their annual sand replenishment that perpetuates a non-natural, man-made state. This would be banned by the MLPA as it would be in direct conflict with para 2853.b.(3)-(4) in the MLPA http://www.dfg.ca.gov/mlpa/pdfs/revisedmp0108a.pdf

(3) To improve recreational, eductaional, and study opportunities provided by marine ecosystems that are subject to MINIMAL HUMAN DISTURBANCE, and to manage these uses in a manner consistent with protecting biodiversity
(4) To protect marine NATURAL HERITAGE, including protection of representative and unique marine life habitats in California waters for tehir intrinsic value.

Yep, I'll be watching, and waiting

[robmandel]

Originally Posted by Hunters Pa

Yep, when they get the reserve passed for Laguna I will be ready and waiting when they do their annual sand replenishment that perpetuates a non-natural, man-made state. This would be banned by the MLPA as it would be in direct conflict with para 2853.b.(3)-(4) in the MLPA http://www.dfg.ca.gov/mlpa/pdfs/revisedmp0108a.pdf

(3) To improve recreational, eductaional, and study opportunities provided by marine ecosystems that are subject to MINIMAL HUMAN DISTURBANCE, and to manage these uses in a manner consistent with protecting biodiversity
(4) To protect marine NATURAL HERITAGE, including protection of representative and unique marine life habitats in California waters for tehir intrinsic value.

Yep, I'll be watching, and waiting

yep, that was my point earlier. I think most those enviros know that fishing isn't really the "problem" so much as mpa's just happen to be anti-fishing. they're not pro-fishing at all, but it serves their purpose. the mpa's can, and no doubt will, be used to do all sorts of drastic things.

sean, your interested in laguna. me, I'm thinking of all that disturbance in paradise cove

[GregAndrew]

The Lagunatics were pretty well represented and focused. There were several arguments against their presentations though. The sewage outfall was the most prominent argument the current shape of the Reserve or any further southward consideration. Most of the rest of the speakers that mentioned it were divers concerned with access through the tide pool areas.

After I left, I thought of the perfect counter to the teacher manipulation of the students. Ask for a show of hands from the students how many have been informed that the fisheries were on the verge of collapse? Then ask if it would surprise them to know that the DFG knows of no fish specie that is on the decline?

[Hunters Pa]

Originally Posted by robmandel

yep, that was my point earlier. I think most those enviros know that fishing isn't really the "problem" so much as mpa's just happen to be anti-fishing. they're not pro-fishing at all, but it serves their purpose. the mpa's can, and no doubt will, be used to do all sorts of drastic things.

sean, your interested in laguna. me, I'm thinking of all that disturbance in paradise cove

The Laguna situation just pisses me off. I'll be watching all the closed areas. And I can't wait to see/hear teh Surfrider reaction when they go to ban surfing in the closures.

[jbm]

The fishing kids were very impressive. The teacher who brought those kids with the dioramas really should be fired. La Jolla Country Day seemed to have brought the whole school.

I found the meeting very informative. I didn't feel informed enough to speak on my own so I handed my card to the wonderful young lady from Bloodydecks. By the end of the meeting, I was starting to wish I had the opportunity to speak. I may head up to Santa Barbara in December.

The PSO, Bloodydecks, and Waterman's alliance people were all really great.

The thing that pissed me off the most was actually all the Laguna Beach people clamoring to keep all those stinky fishermen off "their" beaches. I will never spend a single dime in that city for the rest of my life.

Mike,
Nice speaking to you in the lobby. I hope your foot didn't give you too much trouble.

Jason

[cabojohn]

Clay scored a couple REAL enviro shirts from the other side today.

[Jzo]

Great read Bob, thx for the post.

[old_rookie]

Originally Posted by jbm

Mike,
Nice speaking to you in the lobby. I hope your foot didn't give you too much trouble.

Jason

Same here Jason. Not much. It only prevented me from meeting more of the members here since I went in early to rest my foot.