WSB hatchery article

[taggermike]

No offense taken Jorluivil. Indeed, Every thing we learn is from experiments. But experiment can go 3 ways. Hypothesis confirmed, failed, or inconclusive. We can learn from all these out comes. And much has been learned from the wsb hatchery program. But it's main goal of enhancing wild stocks is increasingly looking like a failure. Its been over 20 years that hatchery produced wsb have been released but they are not being found in significant numbers in the adult population of wsb off our coast. I feel that this experiment has run long enough to ascertain if the program is working. And it isn't.

This is no slap in the face to those that have worked hard on this program. Their work wasn't wasted. The real waste of their efforts is to continue to operate as if the hatchery program is succeeding. Much was learned but the program has not come close to fulfilling it's goals. If the program only operates to make people feel good then that is a true waste of hard work, effort, and money. Mike

[jorluivil]

Originally Posted by taggermike

No offense taken Jorluivil. Indeed, Every thing we learn is from experiments. But experiment can go 3 ways. Hypothesis confirmed, failed, or inconclusive. We can learn from all these out comes. And much has been learned from the wsb hatchery program. But it's main goal of enhancing wild stocks is increasingly looking like a failure. Its been over 20 years that hatchery produced wsb have been released but they are not being found in significant numbers in the adult population of wsb off our coast. I feel that this experiment has run long enough to ascertain if the program is working. And it isn't.

This is no slap in the face to those that have worked hard on this program. Their work wasn't wasted. The real waste of their efforts is to continue to operate as if the hatchery program is succeeding. Much was learned but the program has not come close to fulfilling it's goals. If the program only operates to make people feel good then that is a true waste of hard work, effort, and money. Mike

[alanw]

There's nothing man can do that is as good as mother nature. These politicians and enviro scientists invent problems to justify their own existence. Here's an idea - stop raping the ocean and it will fix itself.

[Saba Slayer]

I think I'll leave it up to the Science Advisory Committee (SAC) to make this important decidsion.
"Its been over 20 years that hatchery produced wsb have been released"...well over 20 years, the first batch of fish was released in 1986.
After 10 years of working with the program and seeing lots of data...Unlike yourself I still don't feel qualified to make this kind of scientific decision... Mike says..."I feel that this experiment has run long enough to ascertain if the program is working. And it isn't." How did you scientifically come to this fact, when it's going to take over 2 years for the scientific community to make this decision. Did the San Diego Coastkeepers influence your decision or are you working with the release and recapture data or is this just your gut feeling?
The SAC group is scheduled to meet in March of 2017 to review their progress. A written draft of their programmatic review is expected Spring 2017 with a final draft anticipated by Fall of 2017. The program will live or die with the decisions made by SAC. and not just a few individuals.

[taggermike]

I chose the 20 year time frame because the the initial releases from the mission bay facility, pre Carlsbad hatchery, were small. I do not have the release and rrecovery data right in front of me. But I have seen it recently. The majority of recovered tagged wsb are juveniles that have come from the Hubbs gill netting survey and from fish killed in power plants rather than adult legal sized fish caught by anglers. I believe tagged fish recovered peaked '08 at 30 fish. Over the last 4 years the recoveries have been in single digits. I dont know the total number of wsb released since 1986. More than 2 million I'm sure. It's a big ocean and this is a complicated program. But after 2 million fish released to recover less than 10 for four years straight indicates very low survival.

Clearly I do not have access to all the data nor the expertice to analyze it all. The low numbers of adult fish recovered in relation to the numbers of juveniles release is a bad sign. Factor in the mortality, euthenasia, and levels of deformity and is appears the program is producing low quality fish with very little chance of survival. I'll be looking forward to the SAC final draft.

I have nothing to do with the coast keepers and haven't heard any thing they have to say about the program. Mike

[GregAndrew]

I would guess that only about 1-5% of WSB caught are actually scanned for tags. But let's say it is 20% for arguments sake. That would put the actual catch of tagged WSB at around 100 per year if all were scanned right? Considering the attrition rate of any inshore species before reaching adulthood, I would consider it an accomplishment if the total number of released fish in the coastal population was 1,000 of the 1,000,000 released. Just like Sea Turtles, of the thousands hatched only a handful make it to adult size. If you think that all 1,000,000 were supposed to make it to 50lbers you need to consider the real fish world.

Also, the idea that any sickness is going to be transferred from these hatch-lings to the adult population is pretty nearsighted. There will be nearly zero chance of interaction of the juveniles with the adults (except as food). And deformities in fish (except in large size) is like them wearing a sign that says "Eat Me", cause predators key in on differences/weaknesses.

Personally, if Hubbs wants to keep funding the rearing and releasing of troubled species, I am all for it.