catch and release pending submission. will this count?? - Kayak Fishing Adventures on Big Water’s Edge

gabe · 09-13-2005, 05:16 PM

Well, sseeing that Todd already passed me up (nice fishies todd) and by a good spread (pending), I had to try and get at least a few points for this week.

FIrst is the typical fish story. I had one, a decent one that got me stuck in the kelp and then came off a few feet fromt he surface. Lets just say he was heavy.

So I cont'd fishing and ws only able to land this little guy. He was 23"

He was 23"

The OTW weight from my scal e varied from 5 LBS 10oz to 6 LBS 2oz. And it seemed to be more stable around 5-10 to 5-12.

And here is the shot with me and the fish. It was self timer shot and the best I could do on my own, so here it is

Hopefully I'll fish again before this week ends

gabe

Blair · 09-13-2005, 05:46 PM

well Gabe I sure hope it does. If this does count i might enter this thing next year. I for the most part do not keep my halibut outside of our monthly tournments. mainly because i seem to be the oddball in my family and circle of friends that likes to eat fish.

Iceman · 09-13-2005, 06:44 PM

Gabe, it definately will count. You fulfilled the requirements and I applaud you. Something that I am considering for next year is an incentive for releasing smaller halibut and YT. Something like only the tape shot required and 15 points, no weighing necessary.

Hook 1 · 09-13-2005, 07:22 PM

Gabe your the sh!t. Good job. To do that with a butt it should be worth 2.5 per pound.
Andy that's a great idea.

madscientist · 09-13-2005, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman

Gabe, it definately will count. You fulfilled the requirements and I applaud you. Something that I am considering for next year is an incentive for releasing smaller halibut and YT. Something like only the tape shot required and 15 points, no weighing necessary.

Sounds like a good idea for the halibut, but do you really want to give 15pts for a 3lb yellow rat. I might become a contender

.

Honestly, I don't quite understand the rationale for not keeping little YT but keeping the big ones (other than Ken and Andy making fun of me). I have no idea what YT mortality is like, but my guess is only 1 in 4 at best, probably much worse, 4lb YT ever makes it to be 20+. Thus, killing a pair of 4#ers is less damaging to the big fish stock than killing one 20# fish. If the situation were that we caught tons of small guys and only the ocassional big one, I could see the logic, but this year so far my big YT(over 15#) to little (<15) ratio is 4:1, through no specific action on my part (never mind that the many fish lost were probably more on the big side of the equation). Is there something I am not seeing? Don't get me wrong, I wish everyone would release their YT so I can catch them 8) .

Aaron&Julie · 09-13-2005, 09:06 PM

Gabe, don't count on that scale being accurate over 10lbs. Aaron's 38lb WSB weighed 30lbs or less using the same model. We knew it was wrong.
Weighed almost 38lbs at Malibu kayaks, even after hours out of the water.
That's a huge difference.

Iceman · 09-13-2005, 09:41 PM

Biology of fish is a mystery to me. The logic in releasing YT that are under 10 pounds would compare to releasing bass under 12" YT spawn at 3 years old and around 10 pounds. An argument for a slot limit of 10-20 would be that female YT over 20 pounds spawn more than once in a year and produce 940,000 eggs. The late, great Charlie Davis firmly believed that the fisherman with rod and reel had next to no effect on any species of fish. I told myself that I would not keep any YT under 10 pounds this year. After catching a 7-8 pounder I ammended my "self regulating" to never posting a picture of one under 10 pounds

There was this one time.............long ago. :twisted:

madscientist · 09-13-2005, 10:02 PM

The only argument I can see for the "wait till they breed once" idea is preservation of genetic diversity, which is only likely to be an issue with species that really stay put (perhaps like calico). Otherwise, the issue is total breeding versus meat taken. Since I think most fish breed exponentially more the older they get, a big old heavy fish is worth many times its equivalent weight in dinks, thus the notion of a slot limit to preserve the big fish. The rationale for the lower end of the size limit is typically to keep total tonnage killed down. For instance, back east I could catch schoolie stripers like crazy, but in the bays a keeper (28") was more rare. If the size limit had been 24" I could have kept probably 7 times the number of fish that I could at 28", thus reducing the potential fish kill dramatically. However, if I was going to take one fish per week and had a roughly equal chance of catching at least one 28" as one 24", then it would seem to be better to keep the little guy.

Is this a weird year for the YT, in that most of the fish have been on the bigger side? If I/we could consistently go out and hammer rats, then I could see a concern, but my experience has been quite the opposite, and as such I don't feel bad taking those sweet little hamachi home for dinner (even if Ken makes fun of me). Heck, it's better than having to eat my bait :P .

katchfish · 09-13-2005, 10:37 PM

Brad, you think too much!! :twisted: :twisted:

As far as I concerned there are only two types of yellowtail, the one you want to keep or the one you want to let go!!

You bought your license, you know the regulations.

Now go fish.

Ken

Slay Rider · 09-14-2005, 06:35 AM

Gabe,

Great job on the fish and the release. I also have that model scale and have found it to be very accurate at all levels. But I still make it a point to verify its accuracy with weights from my set of freeweights every now and then.

SR

Jimm H · 09-14-2005, 05:10 PM

To your thought about a catch and release point award rule mechanism, why don't you consider awarding a weight for the caught and released fish weighted on the water based on the average of the high and low weights measured. It would be more accurate and fair versus a fixed amount of points. And, like golf, this tournament relies to a certain extent on the honesty of the participants.

You could require a photo of one of the two weights, and your tape shot.

Iceman · 09-14-2005, 05:45 PM

There really is no release incentive with your idea JiMM. Your way the person would likely get X amount of points kept or released.

cabojohn · 09-14-2005, 06:29 PM

Right on Gabe!
May good karma come your way.
(but not during a tournament) he he

john

gabe · 09-14-2005, 08:02 PM

Aaron&Julie, & EE

I have found my scale to be consistant with my free weights at home as well. The only reason for the weight discrepancy was due to being on the water and going up and down from the swell of passing boats.

Thnuder Chicken,
No luck at tournaments. C'mon I need it. I have trouble weighing fish at tournaments. I need the luck. I wish I was as lucky as Kailey was. Man, what an awesome fish for a young child! that was cool

gabe

Aaron&Julie · 09-14-2005, 08:59 PM

It must be QA. Some of the ones sold are NOT accurate. You two are fortunate that yours are true when compared with your free weights. This WSB Aaron caught:

measured barely 30lbs on the beach (fluctuating between 27 and 30lbs) using that scale, brand new. We knew this had to be wrong and weighed it at Malibu kayaks, using a better model scale it went 37lbs. 6 oz.
Our bad experience with this scale has already been verified with other users. Glad you guys have ones that work properly.
In fact, most everyone agrees Julie's yellowtail:

which weighed 32lbs. on the same scale, looked closer to 40lbs. and Aaron's 29lb yellowtail:

probably closer to 35lb.
We want to buy a better scale, suggestions anyone?

gabe · 09-14-2005, 09:15 PM

Aaron &Julie
sweet fish. I also compared my scale with a couple of buddies who had difeerent manufacturers. They were only off by a few ounces

good luck
gabe

Jimm H · 09-15-2005, 08:35 AM

You are basing your C&R rules on the assumption that only SMALL fish would be released. A fixed point system encourages participants to keep anything that is presumed larger than a 7-8 lb halibut, for instance. I was just thinking of a fair way to allow for release of any legal sized fish, including larger fish. (I know, most of us would never consider that!)

Your tournament.... you make the call. I'm sure either system will benefit the participants and the fishery.

Iceman · 09-15-2005, 06:05 PM

Jimm, STFU..........you are only going to enter if I make everyone fish in a bra and panties.

MKNOTT · 09-15-2005, 07:00 PM

:lol: :lol: :lol: You gonna take that?

Just my perspective....... People will release smaller fish when they have fish in the cooler already. I have yet to see any of the people I know including myself release a nice fish weather they are WCW or not. A big a$$ fish is what it's all about . Right? MKNOTT

lamb · 09-15-2005, 08:16 PM

Damn right! Totally true about full freezers. No filleting, no messy stuff to give to friends?

Andy, :lol: :lol: :lol: . But Jim has a valid vision. 8)

Maybe every fish released is honest estimated weight +5, + whatever?

Black sea bass could count to. Why not? Augh, I see… Someone catches 300 lber. Estimate on that big of a fish would be a war. :roll:

Another thing you should throw in – there is no signing up in the WCW. It is mandatory for everyone with the bigwatersedge.com login account. You want to read? You’ve got to play.

Cmon, $25 is nothing. We could be talking some $$$ lambawards. Ba-a-a-aaah$$$.

Give some green to Scripps WSB program. 8)

And Gabe, kudos!!!

09-13-2005, 05:16 PM	#1
gabe Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 120	catch and release pending submission. will this count?? Well, sseeing that Todd already passed me up (nice fishies todd) and by a good spread (pending), I had to try and get at least a few points for this week. FIrst is the typical fish story. I had one, a decent one that got me stuck in the kelp and then came off a few feet fromt he surface. Lets just say he was heavy. So I cont'd fishing and ws only able to land this little guy. He was 23" He was 23" The OTW weight from my scal e varied from 5 LBS 10oz to 6 LBS 2oz. And it seemed to be more stable around 5-10 to 5-12. And here is the shot with me and the fish. It was self timer shot and the best I could do on my own, so here it is Hopefully I'll fish again before this week ends gabe

09-13-2005, 06:44 PM	#3
Iceman Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: 1-2 miles off the point Posts: 6,943	Gabe, it definately will count. You fulfilled the requirements and I applaud you. Something that I am considering for next year is an incentive for releasing smaller halibut and YT. Something like only the tape shot required and 15 points, no weighing necessary. __________________

09-13-2005, 07:22 PM	#4
Hook 1 Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Marco.....Polo Posts: 98	Gabe your the sh!t. Good job. To do that with a butt it should be worth 2.5 per pound. Andy that's a great idea. __________________ High 5.....Come On Guys Mark

09-13-2005, 09:06 PM	#6
Aaron&Julie Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Spring Valley Posts: 1,400	Congratulations Gabe, don't count on that scale being accurate over 10lbs. Aaron's 38lb WSB weighed 30lbs or less using the same model. We knew it was wrong. Weighed almost 38lbs at Malibu kayaks, even after hours out of the water. That's a huge difference. __________________ "Never say die"

09-13-2005, 09:41 PM	#7
Iceman Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: 1-2 miles off the point Posts: 6,943	Biology of fish is a mystery to me. The logic in releasing YT that are under 10 pounds would compare to releasing bass under 12" YT spawn at 3 years old and around 10 pounds. An argument for a slot limit of 10-20 would be that female YT over 20 pounds spawn more than once in a year and produce 940,000 eggs. The late, great Charlie Davis firmly believed that the fisherman with rod and reel had next to no effect on any species of fish. I told myself that I would not keep any YT under 10 pounds this year. After catching a 7-8 pounder I ammended my "self regulating" to never posting a picture of one under 10 pounds There was this one time.............long ago. :twisted: __________________

09-13-2005, 05:46 PM	#2
Blair Junior Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 25	well Gabe I sure hope it does. If this does count i might enter this thing next year. I for the most part do not keep my halibut outside of our monthly tournments. mainly because i seem to be the oddball in my family and circle of friends that likes to eat fish.

09-13-2005, 10:02 PM	#8
madscientist Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,906	The only argument I can see for the "wait till they breed once" idea is preservation of genetic diversity, which is only likely to be an issue with species that really stay put (perhaps like calico). Otherwise, the issue is total breeding versus meat taken. Since I think most fish breed exponentially more the older they get, a big old heavy fish is worth many times its equivalent weight in dinks, thus the notion of a slot limit to preserve the big fish. The rationale for the lower end of the size limit is typically to keep total tonnage killed down. For instance, back east I could catch schoolie stripers like crazy, but in the bays a keeper (28") was more rare. If the size limit had been 24" I could have kept probably 7 times the number of fish that I could at 28", thus reducing the potential fish kill dramatically. However, if I was going to take one fish per week and had a roughly equal chance of catching at least one 28" as one 24", then it would seem to be better to keep the little guy. Is this a weird year for the YT, in that most of the fish have been on the bigger side? If I/we could consistently go out and hammer rats, then I could see a concern, but my experience has been quite the opposite, and as such I don't feel bad taking those sweet little hamachi home for dinner (even if Ken makes fun of me). Heck, it's better than having to eat my bait :P .

09-13-2005, 10:37 PM	#9
katchfish Paddle for Mahi Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Doing the happy paddle! Posts: 848	Brad, you think too much!! :twisted: :twisted: As far as I concerned there are only two types of yellowtail, the one you want to keep or the one you want to let go!! You bought your license, you know the regulations. Now go fish. Ken

09-14-2005, 06:35 AM	#10
Slay Rider Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: 1 Posts: 108	Gabe, Great job on the fish and the release. I also have that model scale and have found it to be very accurate at all levels. But I still make it a point to verify its accuracy with weights from my set of freeweights every now and then. SR __________________

09-14-2005, 05:10 PM	#11
Jimm H Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Rancho Bernardo-San Diego Posts: 117	Andy, how about this? To your thought about a catch and release point award rule mechanism, why don't you consider awarding a weight for the caught and released fish weighted on the water based on the average of the high and low weights measured. It would be more accurate and fair versus a fixed amount of points. And, like golf, this tournament relies to a certain extent on the honesty of the participants. You could require a photo of one of the two weights, and your tape shot.

09-14-2005, 05:45 PM	#12
Iceman Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: 1-2 miles off the point Posts: 6,943	There really is no release incentive with your idea JiMM. Your way the person would likely get X amount of points kept or released. __________________

09-14-2005, 06:29 PM	#13
cabojohn PROBATION Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 656	Right on Gabe! May good karma come your way. (but not during a tournament) he he john

09-14-2005, 08:02 PM	#14
gabe Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 120	Aaron&Julie, & EE I have found my scale to be consistant with my free weights at home as well. The only reason for the weight discrepancy was due to being on the water and going up and down from the swell of passing boats. Thnuder Chicken, No luck at tournaments. C'mon I need it. I have trouble weighing fish at tournaments. I need the luck. I wish I was as lucky as Kailey was. Man, what an awesome fish for a young child! that was cool gabe

09-14-2005, 08:59 PM	#15
Aaron&Julie Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Spring Valley Posts: 1,400	Slayrider/Gabe It must be QA. Some of the ones sold are NOT accurate. You two are fortunate that yours are true when compared with your free weights. This WSB Aaron caught: measured barely 30lbs on the beach (fluctuating between 27 and 30lbs) using that scale, brand new. We knew this had to be wrong and weighed it at Malibu kayaks, using a better model scale it went 37lbs. 6 oz. Our bad experience with this scale has already been verified with other users. Glad you guys have ones that work properly. In fact, most everyone agrees Julie's yellowtail: which weighed 32lbs. on the same scale, looked closer to 40lbs. and Aaron's 29lb yellowtail: probably closer to 35lb. We want to buy a better scale, suggestions anyone? __________________ "Never say die"

09-14-2005, 09:15 PM	#16
gabe Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 120	Aaron &Julie sweet fish. I also compared my scale with a couple of buddies who had difeerent manufacturers. They were only off by a few ounces good luck gabe

09-15-2005, 08:35 AM	#17
Jimm H Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Rancho Bernardo-San Diego Posts: 117	Andy You are basing your C&R rules on the assumption that only SMALL fish would be released. A fixed point system encourages participants to keep anything that is presumed larger than a 7-8 lb halibut, for instance. I was just thinking of a fair way to allow for release of any legal sized fish, including larger fish. (I know, most of us would never consider that!) Your tournament.... you make the call. I'm sure either system will benefit the participants and the fishery.

09-15-2005, 06:05 PM	#18
Iceman Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: 1-2 miles off the point Posts: 6,943	Jimm, STFU..........you are only going to enter if I make everyone fish in a bra and panties. __________________

09-15-2005, 07:00 PM	#19
MKNOTT Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Persian Gulf Posts: 263	:lol: :lol: :lol: You gonna take that? Just my perspective....... People will release smaller fish when they have fish in the cooler already. I have yet to see any of the people I know including myself release a nice fish weather they are WCW or not. A big a$$ fish is what it's all about . Right? MKNOTT

09-15-2005, 08:16 PM	#20
lamb Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,563	Damn right! Totally true about full freezers. No filleting, no messy stuff to give to friends? Andy, :lol: :lol: :lol: . But Jim has a valid vision. 8) Maybe every fish released is honest estimated weight +5, + whatever? Black sea bass could count to. Why not? Augh, I see… Someone catches 300 lber. Estimate on that big of a fish would be a war. :roll: Another thing you should throw in – there is no signing up in the WCW. It is mandatory for everyone with the bigwatersedge.com login account. You want to read? You’ve got to play. Cmon, $25 is nothing. We could be talking some $$$ lambawards. Ba-a-a-aaah$$$. Give some green to Scripps WSB program. 8) And Gabe, kudos!!! __________________ [------------------------ <)))< ....b-a-a-a-a