settings for hbird 718/728

[ikrash]

anybody who owns an hbird 718 who can share their settings would be much appreciated

damn i wanna see those arcs!

[-scallywag-]

Originally Posted by ikrash

damn i wanna see those arcs!

sometimes (ok , most of the time...) I peddle around all day look'in for those things!










I had that sonar in the past, it's the same as just about everyother H-bird but with a larger screen....it's a decent unit but lacks the uni-map gps software.

The settings are real simple on those units... to get to the advanced menu hit menu twice. Make sure it is set to saltwater, turn both transducer frequencies on, and turn the fish ID off. Turn all the alarms off.

If you hit view twice it will take you to the split screen for the two sonar frequencies. Sometimes there will be alot of bait or clutter on the screen and usually one of the frequencies will be much clearer allowing you to pick out larger fish and heavier bait concentrations.

There are also a few filters for bottom or surface clutter but I don't mess with those too much and leave them off. Read the manual and play with the settings while on the water with some bait soaking.

Oh, and don't reley soley on your FF, while it is a usefull tool, if the screen is blank and you get the weird feeling in the pit of your stomach, fish the area!!

[mtnbykr2]

Hey there,
I have a 718, as far as settings I will go back and forth from about 5 outta 10 on most settings, and factory default. As far as the arcs you can increase the sensitivity to see more detail, but I generally change the sonar to universal seems to be a bit more detail than dual beam but that's just me.
Do you have the gps hooked up to the 718? I am waiting for mine to arrive, have not installed it yet...we will see...I have been caught out in the fog one too many times...lol....late ...b

You will never see arcs on your 718 no matter what the settings
since it isn't powerful enough and doesn't have the high resolution
pixels. But, I already told you that in a pm 2 wks ago.

[MVC]

Yani, I have the 728 which I think is the same unit that you have. Could you let me know what settings you normally use? Also have you looked into the GPS,s that are compatible with the 728?

[ikrash]

yani:

compatible color units with same pixels and rms can track a jig up to 150 yards down

if the 718 cannot see an arc of a fish 3 feet long and half a foot wide then idk what is wrong

most fishing that would require me to "see" the fish would be in under 100 ft of water

otherwise i'm trolling a mack 100 yards behind

we'll see though

i havent given it a test ride yet...i DO wanna get that gps though

would be so cool...but that would be it...functionality would be relatively useless imo...but who knows

[ikrash]

btw...no disrespect intended

i see the use of the extra rms power as well as the added detail in the screen...

just extra money isn't somethign i had and it seemed like the 718 was the best bang for the buck

soooooo...i do appreciate your information yani...from "2 weeks ago" and the quickness of the response...

but unfortunately such an expensive unit is not an option for me right now....

MVC (name?),

I remember the 728 is compatible with an external GPS.
As far as my settings, it just depends.

Here's a few things I do:
Be willing to experiment with the settings since even the
water's turbidity can effect your ff along with other factors.
So don't think that once you've set them, you'll never touch
them again.

If I'm looking for bait, I increase the sensitivity, or gain.
If I'm just looking for big fish, I decrease the sensitivity.

Learn to fish with your dual sonar screen since the narrower beam
screen gives you greater detail. Which will show the arcs better.

Learn to recognize what arcs really look like. Since only under
unachievable perfect conditions, will you get perfect arcs. This is because the surface isn't perfectly flat, your kayak isn't perfectly still, etc. Therefore the arcs are distorted, but the 728 will show them. Sometimes as half or paritial arcs.

But here's what you really need to do. Get yourself where there are
fish. Then look at your FF. But be sure your over fish, like when
there's people hooking up around you, or even when you are hooked
up. And here's another way, fish with someone with a super-duper
FF who's knows there are fish around and can see arcs under his kayak.
Then look for the arcs.

Here's an example. I was fishing with the Kid. A super fisherman with tons of experience and a great FF. He told me there was a mark under him, so I looked at my FF and saw a long thin squiggly line near the bottom. I thought to myself, that can't be a mark. Next thing I know, he's hooked up. Now I know what a lone single big fish mark looks like on my unit.

Be patient, it took me 4-5 outings before I recognized my arcs. But have
faith, your ff will show them.

Ikrash,

no disrepect intended. But you've got a square peg
that will not fit into a round hole. Don't waste your time
trying to get the 718 to show you arcs. It'll will show you
bait and depth and temp, but your arcs will be unrecognizable.

Be smart, and learn from my mistakes.

[ikrash]

no disrespect taken...i agree with you in lots of aspects and understand that you've got more experience with this topic than i...

with that said...

a. you can see a jig going 150 feet deep
b. a fish is larger than a jig

therefore: you can see a fish 150 feet deep

idk..that's my logic...

monday will be trial day #1 where i screw around with settings and see

worst case scenario i'll count my losses and sell the 718 for half what i paid for it and buy an hds-5

i still want the gps!!!! anybody got one used?


btw...."turbidity" is in actuality turbulence...aka..the movement of water

BUTTTTTTTTTT!!!!..........turbulence only affects readings when there is a high change in temperature (aka density of water) which even hds-10 would not be able to solve...

it's like looking at a star through a $100 telescope or a $10000000 telescope....the density of air "turbulating" around will distort the image...



PAIZZZZ

[MVC]

Thanks for the advice Yani. I need to get familiar with all of the settings. I am fishing tomorrow and will try the dual screens.
Mike

[RedSledTeam]

Gents:
Even though the fish is 4 feet long, his swim bladder is only about 8-12 long which is actually what your ff is reading giving you a "mark" or an "arc". So crank up the sensitivity until you see something, then back it off a little.

Ikrash,

You asked for it, so here goes:

Turbidity is defined to be
--not clear or transparent because of stirred-up sediment or the like; clouded; opaque; obscured: the turbid waters near the waterfall.

That definition is found in any English Dictionary. I thought I was helping
you with Fishing, not English.

So you believe that if you can see a jig at 150', you therefore can
see a fish too. A jig, my friend, shows up, even with an under powered FF like the 718, as a small cluster of dots, just like small macks do. But when
a big fish shows up under that piss poor 718, it will look like a cluster of jigs or a cluster of small macks. Then it will be up to you to figure out what's under your kayak. And while you're doing that, another opportunity will pass you by...

By the way, why do you need to see arcs in your FF anyway? According to your pm to me, "seeing fish isn't key" but rather trolling
a mack 100 yards behind you is. So what would you do if you could see arcs on your FF while you're trolling a mack a 100 yards behind you. Ask the arcs to stay put while you reel in your 100 yards of line so you could finally present your bait to the arcs? Do you know why experienced kayakfishermen carry knives? To cut off thoughtless fisherman who troll their lines too far back. Trolling a live mack is the only way to catch fish? Funny, this year alone, I've seen over 100 yellowtail and WSB caught by people not trolling a thing.

And just one more thing about your last pm to me. You mentioned that although you're sort of a newbie, you've caught more fish in one month than most La Jolla Kayakfishermen catch in a year.

I enjoy helping newbies out. Even when I have to go over the same stuff multiple times. It just the arrogant ones I try to avoid.

[ikrash]

???

didn't state how many fish i have caught, nor did i allude to being in ANY way a master fisherman...i would say that is a bad interpretation of a pm asking for suggestions on settings for a ff

i understood your opinion on getting a 728 and also stated that i was genuinely thankful for such a speedy response (check your pm)..but no need to state over and over again that the 718 is trash...i apologize..not everybody's got cushy jobs (btw...you spoke of arrogance?) ...if you dont wanna share your settings..thats okey dokey...just say that they are private...

"finally" :

what would the logic be to upgrade my ff if i didnt think that seeing the fish was key? dont quote my words out of context as well as with the wrong intention...this isn't a war....i asked your opinion...appreciated it...and asked for your settings...responses that lack an answer to the question as well as insult are going to be met with "arrogance"

i DO NOT know as much as you do (as previously stated), but my opinion is that logically, you are incorrect.....i VERY WELL may be wrong (as previously stated), but i would like the best chance of seeing these fish, and (as previously stated) if i cannot i WILL upgrade to the 728 (your suggestion)

so just chill...it'll all be allright
what difference does it make

its not like there's fish in la jolla anyways....right?

[ikrash]

also...

and this is just a question...so relax

wouldn't turbidity affect all units, regardless of power?

wouldn't it be the frequency that would allow you to see through the mess of salt/red tide/etc?

as well as...(again a question...again relax)

why would a fish appear as a grip of jigs when (i think) the beam reflected is off the top portion of the fish(?)..unless there was a lack of accuracy in the receiving portion of the transducer?



btw...i only troll (+-) 100 yards when im pretty much alone in the deep...so feel free to cut my lines if i cross you...i always feel like i need to get rid of 50 yards or so every so often (keeps it fresh...ya know?)

smile...it's sunny tomorrow...it'll all be alright

[deepdvr]

just quit while you're ahead dude

[ikrash]

already did....difference in opinions i think...hope no hard feelings

wishing the best fishing to all of you

[GregAndrew]

I am a novice at FF myself, but it seems to me that you are trying to compare apples to oranges. The return from a hard iron should be far stronger (darker) than the return from a soft fleshy bodied creature shouldn't it? Especially one like a WSB that has an unusually large (air filled) swim bladder.

[Aaron]

Greg,


Here's some FF 101. Why see arcs?

FF's have two modes. Fish ID and arcs. The problem
with Fish ID is this: If you have a school of macks under
you, your FF (with Fish ID on) will show the biggest
mack as a big fish on your monitor. Or if you have a whale
under you, again, your ff will show a big fish.

But the arcs will show you relative "real" sizes of fish.

Let's define arcs.

The sonar beam under the kayak is like a fanned out flashlite beam
aiming towards the bottom. On some paper draw the ocean
floor, the water's surface and you with a big halibut in your
yak with the flashlite beam pointing towards the bottom.

As a big fish enters the flashlite beam, it's entering the longest
part of the fanned out beam. So, your ff marks the fish, deeper than it is.
Since the sonar sound wave is traveling its furthest. Now, as the fish continues to swim, it is directly underneath your yak and thus, your ff (continuing to mark the fish) thinks the fish is closer since the sonar sound wave is traveling as shorter distance, its center. Now, your monitor will show an up swing in its representation of the fish. Then, as the fish continues and moves towards outer beam, your ff will see the fish as further down since, again, the sonar sound beam is traveling further.
This is why a FF shows a big fish as an arch.

If the ocean were perfectly still, and your yak was perfectly still, arcs would look like perfect arcs. Caveat: Don't be decieved by any FF's simulation. That's preprogrammed stuff that isn't reality.

Since everything is moving, the game is to see unperfect arcs and recognize them for what they are.

Now the next topic: Seeing arcs. I've been thinking for the best way to communicate this concept. Here goes an analogy.

Imagine you're looking for Big Eagles perched on trees with a digital camera. You're taking pictures, from 50yards, and then looking at the prints. You're trying to find the Eagles in and amongest the leaves and branches.

If your camera has an expensive, good lens, it will pick up all the detail you need see the eagle. But then, your printer, that prints the image, has
got to print that image with high pixelation (sp?). So you can see the diff
between the Eagle and the other stuff.

Even if the Eagle is perched all alone on a branch without leaves, you would think that it would be easy to see on print. Not if you camera's lens is poor or out of focus, and not if your printed picture has big pixels. What you will see is a branch that has leaves on it. Because you won't be able to make out the Eagle's outline.

That's how a good FF works. It has to have the power to pick up the details of the Big Fish and the high resolution Pixels to show the details of the Big Fish from its surroundings, like bait fish. When I say details of the Big Fish, I mean the arch.

I've found that a power rating (ability to pick up details) of 500RMS is a minimum. And screen pixelation (ability to show details) is 480x480 is a minimum. Otherwise, you won't be albe to tell the Eagle from the Leaves.
A color unit having these specs is more money than a B/W.

As a side note. It's true that a jig is denser than a fish, but FF will show a jig, a mack, and a big fish as a solid mark. So the game is to figure out whether you're looking at a big fish arch or a cluster of baitfish that look like a big fish arch.

And, it's also true that good FF pick up swimbladders. But that's not all. The good color Lowarances show the long arcs of big fish with their swimbladders. If FF's only showed bladders, then they would never show jigs or bottom contours since they don't have bladders.

So there you have it. Although it may not seem obvious, the next step is to figure out what to do once you've found the arches. My advice to most fishermen fishing LJ is simple: Pay Josh to learn the right way to deal with the arches.

My advice to you, Greg: Stop Fishing.

Oh, Ikrash. My settings are not a secret, I've laid out how I set my FF in this very post to Mike. I suggest you take off your blinders.